Binance founder Zhao Changpeng discusses BNB, BNBChain and its ecosystem.

Source: RPC Cat Friends Association (Nine Lives Commune)

Introduction of the guest speakers:

David Namdar (X@namdar): CEO of BNC and co-founder of Galaxy Digital, with over a decade of experience in cryptocurrency and capital markets. He is currently the CEO of BNB Network Company (BNC), a Nasdaq-listed company, leading a digital asset treasury project centered around BNB, referred to by outsiders as the "BNB version of MicroStrategy."

CZ: The founder and former CEO of Binance, he is also one of the most influential entrepreneurs in the global cryptocurrency industry.

David: Good morning, CZ. Nice to see you. CZ: Good morning, David. Nice to see you.

David: I am very excited to start this conversation with you. We have known each other for a long time, and it has been quite a journey. The recent market has also been very exciting, especially today as BNB is hitting new historical highs. How are things on your side? Where are you connecting from?

CZ: The situation is quite good. I'm currently in Tokyo. As you said, BNB is hitting new all-time highs. I'm not quite sure what is causing what, but I believe your efforts surely played a part, so thank you. Overall, everything is pretty good.

David: I'm very glad to hear that. I want to revisit our journey in the crypto space from the beginning. It has been an exciting journey together. Back in 2017, when BNB was first launched, it really stood out during that wave, being the first project to break the mold and was quite innovative at the time. How do you view the evolution over these years now? Did you ever think it would grow into such a thriving ecosystem today?

CZ: That's a great question. Initially (in 2017), BNB was an ERC-20 token on Ethereum, just used for fundraising. We knew at the time that we would develop a blockchain that was public, decentralized, etc. But I honestly didn't expect it to grow into a complete ecosystem. So seeing all of this now is really fulfilling. To be frank, for most of the past seven or eight years, I've been busy operating a centralized exchange, and during that time, I didn't actually spend much time on the BNB chain. For the past couple of years, I've also had to deal with the U.S. government, handling cases with them, flying to the U.S., and spending four months in jail, among other things. So, in these 7-8 years, we haven't really invested a lot of time and energy into the BNB chain. However, despite that, the community has still grown. Especially this year, we've started to pay more attention to the BNB chain. I'm also now investing more attention into the BNB chain— I don't have anything else to do.

CZ: Moreover, you are also in this ecosystem, which is really empowering. This year we have seen the BNB chain really thriving. This is truly a good thing. I believe that even to this day, the BNB chain is still "underdeveloped", and the entire ecosystem is still "underdeveloped". This means there are still many opportunities for different projects to have space to grow. Overall, I think it's great.

David: Yes, I completely agree. Recently, I have indeed been carrying the flag for BNB outside, and I do my best to explain to investors the difference between BNB (as an asset) and BNB Chain (the entire ecosystem), as well as how it has developed to no longer be tied to any single company. How do you usually explain this difference to everyone?

CZ: Yes, many people are confused because many media outlets like to refer to BNB as 'Binance Coin'. This is related to history: it was indeed called that name at first. We have since tried a few times to rebrand in hopes of distinguishing the two. BNB initially had more rights on the centralized exchange of Binance, but now, as you said, it has become a thriving ecosystem in its own right. BNB is a native asset on multiple blockchains, currently including BNB Smart Chain, Greenfield, opBNB, and previously the BNB Beacon Chain based on Tendermint. In the future, BNB will also be the native token of multiple blockchains adopting newer technologies.

CZ: BNB is a token that provides momentum for the decentralized ecosystem of the BNB blockchain, and it is very different from the "token of Binance Company." Although Binance's centralized exchange still offers trading fee discounts for using BNB, that is just one of many use cases. The centralized exchange also provides opportunities for BNB holders to participate in some yield-generating airdrops, such as Launchpad, Launchpool, Binance Alpha, etc. But again, this is just a part of BNB's rights. BNB itself is a very vibrant and large ecosystem: there are multiple DEXs, perpetual contract DEXs, lending protocols, stablecoins, and more on the chain. There are so many things on the BNB blockchain. In fact, I also find it quite difficult to explain clearly to many people; it can be confusing for everyone—so I think you do better than I do in this regard. Thank you for your help.

David: No, no, it's not quite that yet, but thank you for the compliment. Listen to me, the one thing I'm really doing out there right now is providing explanations as much as possible. You know, we've talked about this many times: I've been in this field for a long time and have witnessed various evolutions. I've seen many people come in and leave, and I've seen iterations and innovations, especially driven by regulatory factors. Right? So for me, being able to clearly explain how this "evolution occurs," including the things you've built over the years, and that you are one of the best builders in the industry, is a wonderful thing.

David: In my opinion, BNB is a collection of many things, and it has already shown that it might be the most sustainable chain for iterative upgrades over the years. Each chain—such as Ethereum—has its own roadmap, many different ideas, and visions for upgrades. We also know that Bitcoin has many "political factors" in terms of BIP (Bitcoin Improvement Proposals), and there are many iterations as well. So, in a sense, BNB can be considered one of the most successful chains in terms of completing upgrades and evolution over the years.

CZ: Yes. I think every chain is actually evolving continuously. The BNB chain has indeed evolved more because it has developed from a Tendermint-based blockchain. It initially started as an ERC-20 token, then migrated to the Tendermint blockchain, and became an EVM-compatible chain, also growing into a Layer 2 (opBNB). Next, we have Greenfield (storage-oriented). Now there are also some new variants being considered and developed by developers. From this perspective, we have evolved more structurally. Most other blockchains start from one architecture and then maintain it; whereas from the perspective of the BNB chain, the BNB token is the native asset of multiple blockchains. The underlying technology can evolve over time.

CZ: I have discussed this several times with some core developers. They are looking at what the "next generation" will be: the next generation architecture must provide 100 times, 1000 times the throughput, greater capacity and stability, lower costs, and must be "fully aware" of AI and ready for AI; at the same time, it must natively support stablecoins, RWA, etc. There is a lot of discussion on this topic. I hope our mindset, and the community's mindset towards BNB, is that this coin will be the native coin of multiple blockchains, and the technology will continue to evolve rapidly. I hope we can achieve this together.

David: Yes, I completely agree. Moreover, a large part of this is about the community, as you mentioned. Over the years, the community has been inspired by you, as well as by the BNB Chain team and all participants. I have been observing myself and have seen high enthusiasm from the outside world. You mentioned stablecoins multiple times just now, so let's delve a little deeper. The "stablecoin story" is timely: recently Circle went public, and combined with Ethereum's performance over the past few months, Wall Street and many investors are beginning to realize the potential of stablecoins, and the passing of the "Genius Act" also brings an impact. I would say to everyone, in many ways, we see strong growth in stablecoins on the BNB Chain, even surpassing Ethereum at certain stages. So, how do you view the landscape of stablecoins on the BNB Chain? From a global perspective, would you consider stablecoins as a kind of "ETF of the dollar"?

CZ: There is so much to discuss about stablecoins. People now realize that stablecoins may be one of the biggest businesses in crypto. Binance, this centralized exchange, has a strong influence in areas like "which projects can go live," but if we look at profitability, I believe Tether might be the most profitable company per capita in human history. For example, they make about 13-15 billion dollars a year with around 200 employees, which is just outrageous. So now everyone wants to create stablecoins. Circle has also achieved some success. In fact, about two years ago, BUSD was halted by the NYDFS, but it grew from 0 to 23 billion in two to three years; and that was during a relatively "anti-crypto" government period (the Biden administration's "war on crypto"). However, USDC was not halted, so it continued to grow and is now publicly listed.

CZ: There are now thousands of projects trying to create stablecoins, which is great. I believe it will bring more diversity; some will offer higher yields, and some will have new features, etc. But if you really look at the landscape of stablecoins, my impression is that in the United States, there isn't that much need for stablecoins. Although today in crypto, the largest stablecoins are denominated in and pegged to the dollar, in the U.S., there is ACH, and domestic transfers are relatively easy. Stablecoins are mainly used in international scenarios outside of the U.S. Stablecoins help make the dollar more dominant globally; to be honest, every country wants their currency to be used more globally. For example, China’s Renminbi also hopes to become a dominant global currency, and other countries feel the same. Stablecoins are one way to achieve this. They help crypto and the blockchain industry better integrate into the traditional financial system, and they provide crypto practitioners with a stable, at least fiat-valued value anchor in the ecosystem; this is also very helpful for various countries. So from a purely economic perspective, countries should encourage the development of their own stablecoins.

CZ: Back to the BNB chain ecosystem. Historically, neither USDT nor USDC has provided strong native support; they only started native issuance recently. I believe Tether has not yet conducted native issuance on the BNB chain, while Circle has begun native issuance, but that too only recently. So there is a gap here, a niche that can be filled. I think USD1 has positioned itself well; we've seen it grow very robustly over the past few months. So I believe stablecoins will continue to exist and will become a major player — to be precise, a very large sector. Looking back a few years, I didn’t quite understand it myself. When we started Binance, I was thinking: who would use stablecoins? Why not just use fiat? But stablecoins do solve many problems: transferring internationally using blockchain is much easier; there are no borders in blockchain, which helps keep prices synchronized across different exchanges; and it is also a more user-friendly "form of fiat". Because of this, it has grown very quickly and will continue to grow. There are still many opportunities in the stablecoin sector on the BNB chain, as it is still underdeveloped. We see significant growth in USD1, and I actually expect more developments there.

David: Yes, I agree. This also brings us back to NYDFS. They are indeed creating problems. Even from the moment I first entered this field, the New York Bit License has been slowing down innovation—not just in New York, but across the United States and even globally, because many regulators look at New York's Bit License and use it as an excuse to slow down the development of crypto, so the "war on crypto" actually started much earlier. Now, when it comes to many stablecoins, I will also go back to the original Tether. Tether was born out of industry demand: people were moving value between different exchanges, while the existing financial infrastructure was trying to block that. Tether played its role and grew into what you mentioned—one of the most profitable companies in the industry and globally. As activity on the BNB chain increases, the demand for stablecoins will naturally be captured and will help support this activity.

David: Next is the next area, RWA. I think we have finally reached the turning point for RWA growth. In the past few cycles, we have seen "start and pause": from the earliest real estate tokenization projects to some fund tokenization. But now we are indeed seeing a lot of RWA activities on the rise. What do you think about our current position in the RWA adoption curve? And what are some observations you've made around the BNB chain?

CZ: We have been in this field for nearly ten years, and we are "hardcore believers" who believe that everything will be tokenized. Not just infrastructure, traditional currency market funds, and even "people" can be tokenized; virtual things can also be. So everything can be tokenized, but tokenization is not easy. Personally, I believe that more traditional financial instruments will be tokenized first because they are more suitable for trading. For example, real estate has less price volatility and lower trading volume, so liquidity is poor. If you tokenize a building, because the price is relatively stable, the trading volume will not be large; without sufficient trading volume, people will not place large orders on the order book, leading to worse liquidity. If you want to enter or exit at the scale of several million dollars or even larger, it will be difficult and prone to abnormal price behavior.

CZ: Not every asset is easy to tokenize. Cryptocurrency assets, due to their large price fluctuations, instead form a "characteristic" that makes people more willing to trade, resulting in higher trading volumes. Additionally, when you tokenize a building, if you want to buy the entire building, you must buy all the tokens available in the market; the last few token holders may not be willing to sell, which can drive the price very high. Furthermore, holding a "piece" of a building does not necessarily mean you can live in it; in other words, how to enjoy certain economic usage rights and economic benefits. There are also regulatory concerns: when you tokenize a building, does it count as a security? Or something else? Who will regulate it? In large countries, this issue is particularly evident because the financial market may have multiple regulators; in other countries, this might not be a problem, but the regulatory framework is still very important — what can these tokens do and what can't they do? Many questions remain unclear today.

CZ: I think RWA will be very large and will grow. If stablecoins are also considered RWA (many people do think so), it is already quite big. Other updated assets will also be very interesting. But I personally believe that traditional financial assets will be tokenized first, then more easily conceptualized and redeemed commodities (like oil, gold), and finally other things.

David: That makes a lot of sense. It's also one of the things I'm excited about in the current cycle: many crypto players are stepping into the traditional financial space like never before; at the same time, we're seeing some TradFi players trying to enter the crypto market. For example, Galaxy — I believe they are among the first, if not the first, to tokenize their equity recently, and you should have seen the related news. We will see more attempts like this. As for whether there will really be significant demand, and whether people in the crypto circle will actually be very interested in participating in the traditional financial market of 'tokenized stocks' — that remains to be seen. Now, back to the topic of 'the migration of value from centralized exchanges to decentralized exchanges' and other future areas. At the recent BNB Day, you mentioned: if you could start over and were twenty years younger, you would focus on AI Agents and a privacy-centric DEX. This resonated with me a lot. When you think about that critical point — I've also heard you talk about a lot of 'future scenarios,' about how the crypto market will transition from centralized exchanges to DEX. How do you think this will evolve?

CZ: Of course. First, let me address the other point you mentioned: the tokenization of stocks. I believe this is the "most obvious" thing to do, because which country wouldn't want their stocks to be accessible to global users? The problem is that most stocks will be classified as "securities." There are very strict laws around securities in various countries (most have regulatory bodies like the SEC), and there is also some kind of international SEC alliance. So now there are some people issuing stock tokens who are trying to skip a lot of "hoops" and separate "tokens" from "securities."

CZ: This will bring problems: the prices of tokens and stocks are not synchronized, which is not right. In my opinion, if there is a price difference, you should buy the cheaper one and then redeem it for the more expensive one; as more people do this, the price difference will disappear. The fact is that the price difference has always existed, indicating that the entire process has not been connected from start to finish. By my definition, this means that this product "still cannot work." But I do believe that stock tokenization is a large market, and we need regulators to provide very clear guidelines—what can be done, what cannot be done, etc. I know that many countries are piloting this, whether in the United States, the UAE, or other countries.

CZ: Back to AI. I believe AI will increase the amount of interactions people have by 3 to 6 orders of magnitude, for example, from a thousand to a million times. In the future, each of us will have tens of thousands of agents working in the background for us. There will be agents to transcribe this content — perhaps there is already AI transcribing this episode of the podcast. I hope in the future there will be agents to edit videos, pick out highlights, help me remove wrinkles, and then post them online, and monetize them in some way. For example, people can watch a third of it first, and to see the remaining two-thirds, they need to pay a little, even just "a small fraction of a few cents." All these transactions will be "ultra-high frequency, ultra-low cost." I believe blockchain is the only solution that can handle this type of transaction. AI will significantly increase the transaction volume of blockchain.

CZ: At the same time, blockchain can do a lot for AI: for example, "secure AI", such as privacy protection, secure training, secure data collection and usage, etc., can all be implemented in a way that is truly controlled by users through blockchain. I have also talked with some AI companies: they will use blockchain to achieve "transparency in the algorithm development process", allowing people to peek inside, because now it is just a black box. We don’t know what data was used for training, but it seems that AI can provide answers. For instance, if I ask AI to summarize any book — if AI has that book, I’m not sure if it has paid for every book; I’m not sure if AI has paid $10 for every existing book; if I ask it to summarize a paid webpage, AI can inexplicably have it. Therefore, there are many potential issues that AI can resolve with blockchain. I believe again that this is a huge industry. A better way to phrase it is: at least in my lifetime, there are three foundational technologies — the Internet, blockchain, and AI. The Internet still has many opportunities, but the latter two have just begun; all three have great growth potential, especially the latter two.

David: I completely agree. I have also spent a lot of time researching the AI market and its evolution. Last year, I was thinking about many ideas, such as establishing a bank dedicated to AI agents — we would each have thousands of agents making "trillion-scale" transactions daily, beyond the scale our brains can comprehend. We need a blockchain-based, scalable ecosystem to support those activities. You also mentioned that AI cannot KYC, and cannot complete account openings with exchanges and banks. So, without blockchain intervention, this is impossible. Looking back to 2017-2018, I was part of one of the earliest AI agent projects, called "Botchain," but it did not materialize. When you have limitless, unimaginable "machine-to-machine" communication, we need to keep records, and those records must be verifiable and on-chain. This way, during audits, we can see where my LLM/agent pulled data from, where yours pulled from, and what agreements they reached over a period.

David: Now I want to take a step back from the discussion of CEX and DEX, as this is another fascinating issue in the market. Looking back over the past few cycles, centralized exchanges have long been key drivers of many activities and have been the "first stop" for many in crypto. Nowadays, we see rapid growth in DEX, and I believe this is a trend that both of us expect to continue. How do you think this will evolve over time?

CZ: This trend is very clear. In the distant future, DEX will be bigger than CEX, and this is very certain. As you said, CEX is, in my opinion, the "stepping stone" for people to enter the crypto world. Users coming from Web2 will find it easier to start with an email and password, with customer service and someone to help them hand-in-hand. The concept of a custodial platform is also easier to understand because it conceptually resembles a bank. However, as they become more experienced, they will say: I now have my own wallet, I can manage it myself, which gives me greater freedom and control, but also means more responsibility (for example, to protect my device). Once people master these, they will turn to DEX.

CZ: Therefore, I am 100% confident that DEX will be larger than CEX in the future. As a result, the chain itself — the ecosystem of the chain — becomes very important. This is also why, in my view, the "ecosystem of the chain" is far more important in the long run than any centralized exchange. In this sense, I am forced to not spend more time on centralized exchanges, which is a good thing. Now I can have more time to contribute to the decentralized ecosystem. Moreover, this is actually quite fascinating because once you get used to it... I would say that, for ordinary people, the decentralized ecosystem is still relatively difficult to use. Trading volume is growing and is quite considerable, but for ordinary users, using decentralized products will present many random strings and many random numbers on the screen — what to do? Even in centralized exchanges, there are many numbers, but at least they are understandable. We need to make the products better and easier to use as a community. But "on-chain, decentralized" is definitely the future; otherwise, we wouldn't be in this industry, right?

David: This is also connected to what excites me about the market today. Looking back at my career: I come from the traditional finance world, but now I am a "crypto geek," a "lifetime cryptographer," and I will continue to be so. I have been trying to connect the crypto market with the capital market: trying to create Bitcoin ETFs, getting Galaxy listed, and helping other companies go public. In every cycle, I try to help more people see opportunities and act as a small bridge between the two markets. As for our current position: we see a lot of activity flowing from centralized exchanges to decentralized exchanges, but at the same time, the vast majority of wealth and capital in the world is still flowing through traditional finance, through centralized exchanges and markets in the traditional world.

David: I believe that the truly great opportunity now is "Digital Asset Treasuries." This is an achievement that Michael Saylor has made in the past five years. In fact, I just talked to someone about this: Michael Saylor has not always been a Bitcoin believer. In contrast, since you and I entered this field, we have consistently raised the flag for Bitcoin while also striving to promote BNB, and we have always been long-term believers. I often tell people: you may be the one I've seen in the industry who can help everyone take a step back and stay focused during every fluctuation — "Stay focused on holding your price, and don't get shaken out by volatility." Volatility is a "characteristic," especially when you are in a rapidly growing asset class. With the improvement of the regulatory environment and the enhancement of investors' understanding of the potential and value of digital assets, I believe Saylor has walked ahead, leading the trend; and there are many others like Simon from Japan's Metaplanet, the current David Bailey, and Anthony Pompliano, who are all raising the flag for Bitcoin, helping people understand how these types of assets can enter government and corporate balance sheets as unique assets.

David: I am also very excited to share the story of BNB with everyone, explaining how special and unique this asset is. On this basis, whether as an investor or as the CEO of an industry-leading digital asset vault company, I see one demand: we must focus on a few truly special and unique crypto assets because not all crypto assets are the same. You and I both know BNB very well—there is something special about it. Over the past few months, it has indeed outperformed Bitcoin; from the start, it has been one of the few assets that can outperform Bitcoin. When you think about digital asset vaults and a new wave of opportunities, how do you view this market and the opportunities within it?

CZ: There are many things to break down here. First, let's return to the starting point: humans like to understand things through "classification," thinking it's easier; for example, "traditional finance vs. Web3," "Web2 vs. Web3." But in reality, there are no boundaries: ultimately, it's all finance, just using different technologies. Traditional finance can fully utilize blockchain technology; banks can use blockchain technology; cryptocurrency companies should also deeply integrate with traditional financial markets and market structures. We shouldn't draw lines to separate them, but should completely merge — terminology is just to help people understand better. In this sense, cryptocurrency companies should tap into the existing market (raise funds, find developers, acquire resources), and the existing financial market should also adopt new technologies.

CZ: Regarding Michael Saylor, my intuition is that he probably started becoming active in the public eye around 2017-2018, maybe even earlier. Once he understands, he has an extremely strong conviction. We have also experienced this: first learning, then a "transformation" or "complete transformation", becoming a firm believer, which allows one to ride through the fluctuations because they can see a longer-term future—not just the prices tomorrow or the day after (which are impossible to predict), but the trends five or ten years down the line. This is interesting. Saylor invented a new structure, and he has indeed tried to explain this point at different times, but I didn't quite understand it, yet I pay my respects to him. This new structure allows crypto companies to raise money from traditional markets. The traditional market is larger, and many investors can buy company stocks but cannot directly buy crypto; by buying stocks that are "indirectly related to crypto", they gain a convenient entry into Web3. Once they have this indirect exposure, they will continue to pay attention to crypto and will also help the ecosystem grow.

CZ: In this regard, Saylor has created one of the most successful companies in the world using an incredibly simple strategy. Although he is a die-hard fan (Bitcoin Maxi, only looking at Bitcoin), there are many other highly successful cryptocurrencies, including BNB and many other public chains. Looking at the success of Binance (the centralized exchange): if it only dealt with Bitcoin, it would be less successful; it is precisely because it has multiple assets that it attracts a large number of users into crypto. You and I both agree that BNB performs strongly and has numerous use cases. We are at the intersection you mentioned: connecting traditional finance with Web3 finance. Tools like DAT allow crypto companies to access traditional market capital while also enabling the traditional market to participate in crypto, which is a win-win situation. The more people who come into contact with BNB or other crypto assets (whether directly or indirectly), the greater their contribution to the crypto ecosystem.

CZ: This is something "extremely beneficial for both parties": once a company or investor gains indirect exposure to BNB, they might recommend it to friends; if they know developers, they might say "Why not develop your protocol on BNB?", "Why not use BNB for this?", "Why not use another crypto asset for that?" This will help the ecosystem grow. An important point is that in a decentralized world, it's not driven by any one company or person. I'm not "driving" everything about BNB; I do what I need to do, but I don't manage everyone in the ecosystem, and they don't report to me. The more people tie their incentives to the ecosystem, the more they will contribute, which in turn helps everyone in the ecosystem. Even in a decentralized world, if we can help more people form "mutual symbiosis," it will also drive ecosystem growth. So I think this is a great thing: Michael Saylor has paved the way, and now we are adopting it, and you are leading the charge, which is fantastic.

David: Thank you for your recognition. As we discussed through multiple crypto cycles, this can be said to be an unforeseen path at the beginning. You spent a lot of time communicating with government officials and company leaders across different countries. We envisioned early on that one day the government would buy digital assets like Bitcoin, Ethereum, and BNB. However, we did not realize at that time that a "corporate form" could emerge, aiming to maximize the "amount of Bitcoin or BNB per share" to accumulate these assets and become a very large holder; this provides investors with an incredible way to gain exposure to these assets and the ecosystem. More importantly, as you mentioned: by gaining this exposure, everyone will gradually dive into the ecosystem, which will form a special "flywheel."

David: I often cite the example of Salvador (the trip we took together a few years ago). Salvador did something special: they adopted Bitcoin to make themselves "go viral". From the perspective of "actually holding Bitcoin", they also gained decent returns on the dollars they invested; but the greater reward was that they "put themselves on the map", making themselves well-known. They attracted entrepreneurs, developers, and investors from all over the world. When 10,000, 20,000, or 100,000 people enter a small country, the compounding effects of scale can fundamentally change the trajectory of that country in a generation. We see similar phenomena all over the world: as long as a country opens its regulations, attracts innovators, entrepreneurs, and capital, and opens its doors to crypto, it will eventually reap more and more dividends over time.

CZ: Absolutely. I completely agree. Before Michael Saylor, if someone had told me "you can create a publicly listed company to buy crypto assets," I would have thought it was too crazy: how could that work? This also reflects my insufficient understanding of the public market and traditional markets—despite having worked in fintech for many years, I never operated a publicly traded company, so I didn't understand. Saylor is obviously more experienced, and he figured it out. Then there's Salvador, which is also very interesting: this is a very clear case of leadership—President Bukele. Without his push, we wouldn't have gone there (why would I go there?); without his push, Binance wouldn't have set up a customer service office there either. I think this is a classic case: a country that rapidly or timely adopts new technologies can gain greater dividends.

CZ: Now let's look at the UAE. The UAE has always been "pro-crypto, pro-AI," attracting many new entrepreneurs. The UAE doesn't have many natural resources—there's oil, but not much else; it's a desert. But now there are (one or two) world-class, thriving cities there. Everyone loves it there, the economy is performing well, and the country is growing rapidly. I believe that those countries that adopt technology early and in the right way will grow very quickly. This brings us back to the innovations we see: RWA, AI, and so on. If a country can adopt these new things, the economy will continue to grow.

David: I also like examples like this. The achievements that the UAE has made in 10–20 years are quite impressive, and growth is based on compound interest. To wrap up, if we talk about your vision for BNB and the entire crypto ecosystem in the next 10–20 years: how do you see "possibilities and potential"? How would you measure "success"?

CZ: My perspective is: how many people can we help with BNB. Many companies do not focus on poor countries and underdeveloped countries, such as Africa and Southeast Asia, because the ROI is not obvious at the moment. But if you look at Binance (the company, not the BNB chain), today there are many users in Africa, and these users currently bring in very little revenue; I believe that in ten years, they will bring in a lot of revenue, and there will be no one else there. We help them first by connecting them to finance; then they will reap the rewards, and the platform will also be compensated in the right way, which is a win-win.

CZ: There are greater opportunities for BNB because it is a decentralized and open network and protocol. What I want to do is: bring the next few billion people into the next wave and provide them with the next stage of financial technology — "the next generation of financial technology". As the world's population is likely to continue to grow, we should empower 10 billion people or more and provide them with financial services. That is the goal in my mind. It is not a price target, nor is it about competing with or surpassing Bitcoin with other public chains. As you said, BNB has indeed outperformed Bitcoin historically, which is remarkable and challenging; but I think that is not the right "benchmark". The right "benchmark" is: as a community, how many people can we help? The more people we help, the more people join the community, and that is the phenomenon of self-growth. We should continue doing this.

David: I think this is a very beautiful answer, thank you. Every time I try to keep everyone in the right mindset: focusing on the long term, concentrating on building, and focusing on helping others. This is a beautiful vision.

CZ: That's right. I think you are in that mindset. You are one of the best personalities I have encountered in the industry, and you have been in this field for a long time with a strong sense of mission. So when you say you are willing to take the lead, we are all very happy. Whether you need my personal assistance, YZi Labs, or help from any of our affiliated companies or teams, we are happy to provide support. At the same time, we are also very willing to seek help from other participants in the ecosystem or participants outside of the BNB chain ecosystem.

CZ: I believe that it is very important for the entire ecosystem to collaborate and grow together, as this will benefit everyone.

David: Absolutely. This has always been my way of working: collaboration. I also like to tell everyone that I have defined "why I love crypto": it is the "most non-zero-sum" game in the world. Good participants are all striving to increase market share. In fact, there's one more thing I want to summarize: think again about the "next billion, the next two billion" people, who will only live in a world where crypto becomes increasingly important. This is a beautiful vision for the future.

CZ: Absolutely, absolutely.

David: CZ, it is my honor. This conversation has been very pleasant, thank you, it was a great discussion. CZ: That's great, thank you very much.

David: See you soon.

Text Organization: RPC Cat Friends Association (Nine Lives Community)

Original interview video:

David J. Namdar:

Source: rpcnftclub